Sovereign Patriots - A4V has been VERY DISAPPOINTING!!

Westville, Indiana 31 comments
Not resolved

My Experience with A4V has been VERY DISAPPOINTING!!

I spent several thousands in paper, copying, and mail and got nothing but Frivolous Filling Fees at $5000 each and was forced into a Chapter 13 Bankruptcy to save my home and one rental property of two. The second one was stolen by the bank and the court then the Bank was kind enough to send me a 1099 for the amount OWED on the loan.

I started the Super Bond / Private Bond For Set-Off / Bonded Promissory Note / UCC Redemption And A4V in May of 2005, mentored by Tom S., Sam K., and David C. I have not put in the full names because anyone that has been around "Commercial Process" knows who they are..

I put everything I could into learning the processes and in the end,, Virtually LOST Everything. I guess the worst part of it is that I was to fault because I trusted these people to help me through the process and in the end when everything was closing in, the Banks were Foreclosing, the Sheriff was virtually at the door of my home and was auctioning of two others, the IRS was issuing Leans and Levy's, State was issuing Tax Warrants and I asked for help,, they Turned Against me, ABANDONED me and then made it look like I was the one to fault.

These Disclaimers they use are BOGUS! I dare any of these so called gurus to stand with me or any of us, side by side and force the Banks, Courts, IRSS and the States to accept the A4V, Bonds, Notes, UCC-1 and what ever else they can come up with.

In the Case of David C. he professes to be,, county notary highest office in law, but when I paid him over $4,000.00 to file his Court documents (Removals) he all of a sudden Disappeared for Several months along with my money.. I see he comes out of hiding every now and then, long enough to get some more peoples money then he disappears again.

Another thing I have seen is that all of these gurus are excellent talkers / salesmen.. they could sell freezers to Eskimos, furs to mink ranchers and egg's to chicken breeders.. thus there capability to sell all of us on there programs. Which brings up the point of non of them asking for money, they may not ask up front, but they get ya with cover costs, seminar fee's and support / help group fee's.

I'm not against paying some one for there services as long as they provide the service and stand by it when all *** breaks loose. ( YEAH RIGHT ) Just try to get one to stand there with you when the Sheriff is auctioning off your property or the IRSS is stealing your paycheck or in my case my Disability Insurance and my wife's Social Security.

I love it when they tell you to do your own "Do Diligence" before getting involved with these processes but when they are constantly changing the process/technology it is very difficult to stay ahead off the "Creditors" and assume you are getting it right.

Lastly, I, through all that has happened to us and continues to happen, I still believe that the government is bankrupt, that we have Unlimited Social Security Funds Due to us, that the banks and the courts are illegally seizing property and freedoms from all of us and that at some point in the not so far future we will take back what is rightfully ours.

Over the last two years since I was abandoned by what I thought to be Friends, I have suffered financially and physically with several strokes, a heart attack, quad bypass, knee surgery and stomach / intestinal surgery for ulcers but I believe god has a purpose for me and I look forward to every day.

Sorry for the rant, but I just wanted to forewarn others of the dangers when you get involved in any of these processes – technologies.

I want to thank all of you for your comments and I intend to answer them as I can. But first I would like to address the Sovereignty issue, Sovereignty is a State of Mind in this countries commercial neighborhoods. To these people a "Sovereign Individual or Person" is nothing more than a crackpot or tax protester or as I was told by a state attorney, I was in a "Flight of Fancy" frame of mind and that I had no case or cause to overcome there litigation and was wished "Good Luck"..

I contacted the IRSS criminal investigation division, gave them the information and requested a "Criminal Investigation" into the matter. I was abruptly told to "Drop it" or they would be looking at me next..

So my friends a Sovereign brothers and sisters, all I can say is that unless your are ready willing and able to loss everything you ever worked for,,, BE VERY CAREFULL OF WHERE AND HOW YOU TREAD!! These people have no consciousness when it comes to our fight to retain our Sovereignty. Money and Lawyers and Banks and the Courts are a very hard and long fight, you better be willing to go all of the way and you had better have capable HELP that is willing to stand with you and not just give you the ol` DO Your Own "Do Diligence" Mumbo Jumbo.

It is *** few Sovereigns that can get through process and come out standing on both feet and of those I would be suspicious and would want Solid Proof of any payoff. Unfortunately I was NOT ONE OF THOSE. Right smack in the middle of everything the very people that I call my Friends and Brothers and Sisters Turned against me for asking them to help me through the rest of the process when they knew I had had stroke and still to this day can not think quick enough on my feet to face down a tax or bank attorney in open court. I now have to depend on those Very Courts to help me get out of the mess they helped get me into.

Again please forgive me for the rant, I Do Believe in Personal Sovereignty, I believe we are entitled to our personal freedoms, I believe God has formed this country to be free from the oppression that it is now struggling with and that only, We can change it, but we can only change it by being honest and honorable and to help each other through the day to day struggles we all face.

NOW, to address your reply's to my first post, only by trying the A4V process do you gain the knowledge and understanding of what it takes to succeed in the process, just be forewarned it is a struggle and not all people will be successful.

The IRSS will not honor anything that is not fought for. We must be able to stand shoulder to shoulder as Sovereigns to make them do the right thing but do not be naive enough to think it will be easy. There will be complications and penalties to bear and even in the end they will not be honorable.

I personally have not heard of Doug Riddle until and friend brought me to this forum and that's partly due to my health issues and healing the past two years, I will make every attempt to read and understand his process. I to pray and hope it might help me in my personal processes.

Question: What I'm curious about is how you fought all those liens. For example, lately some courts ruled that in order to foreclose, the bank has to provide the original contract/mortgage, and since most banks sell that to investors, they can't produce it.

Ans: the liens and levy's are still being enforced only by filling a BK-13 have I managed to stop any further execution of them or a foreclosure. Like I wrote earlier I do not have the thought process and capability due to the strokes to stand before a court and battle the crooks that are attempting to steal everything from us.

As for the foreclosure's there is only one group I have found that is willing to help and fight for you but they are limited to the attorneys that "Get IT" and Indiana does not have one.

Question: why are you at all even on this site. this talks about sovereignty . Are you still interested in being sovereign after all this jas happened to you? I would think that after this has happened to you , you would stay as far away from this stuff as possible. Are you still interested in this road?

Ans: YES!!! I am still interested in sovereignty and believe in it, but I must be careful not to over due it due to my health issues. I am drawn to it like a moth to a flame but smart enough to know I can be burned. I have hundreds of documents but Yes I will post copies of the frivolous filing letters along with the lien's, levy's and notices.

Question: Plus i been thinking everyone talks about what the possiblities are at being a secured creditor and sovereign but ther is litle evidence. To show what how to really operate as creditor and a sovereign. it like they use words to talk you in circles but know one can offer pure concrete evidence as to how this stuff works.

Question: But they are very clear to ask for money and when you ask a question they drag out the answer and never give the solution to your question they start using word you don't understand and does not show how to use the stand you are on.

Ans: Now you know where I'm coming from, I was drug into this by a friend who suggested I talk to a mentor, and that mentor took me through the process clear up to the point where the IRSS, state, banks, and courts were knocking on the doors and then let me standing there, broken and unable to defend myself even if I wanted to.


Question: Either they are done wrong, or they are instructed to send them back upon first receiving them with a FF letter to see if you'll give up right then and there, and most do. There are also 22 IRS branches, all of which are private corporations who work as collection agents for the US TREASURY, and compete against each other for your business. Which did you send your A4Vs to? Was it one of the 3 listed in Doug Riddles A4V material?

Ans: I can not say what others have done but I sent mine to Ogden, UT, See my exhibit: 2006-04-03_IRSS_FFN.pdf, then look at the FF letters, you will see that they are issued out of another branch. When I asked the Criminal Investigation Division why they are separated, I was told it was for their improved efficiency and accountability.

Review about: Disappointing Experience.


Detroit, Michigan, United States #1252154



I plan on calling the irs and have them walk me through the process.I was told they would do this for you as THEY are the duly authorized administrator of this process.

the govt handed it to them to deal with whem they came into being.they know all the forms and documents to file and don't forget, you have to pay tax on your social security bond account funds with a 10-99 o I d


dlang I would appreciate some help Ken

New York, New York, United States #998901

you make a living doing this I would apprecieate some help

New York, New York, United States #998900

Sorry to hear that I actually found case law stating Jerome daly took on the feds and banks and they both stated that there were no loans of money


I have just recently come across a service which allows you to fill out or edit PDF forms online without having to download any software. I was able to print out my document and even fax it online. Please check this website

I'm sure you will definitely find the service useful and easy to use.

Southington, Connecticut, United States #620871

So if you use *** correctly and toil with what you need to be as effective as possible you will have the best soil to plant your vegetables and fruits trees in.So for the real bullshitters you must decide if you are not adding the proper ingredients you will not get the correct results.

That being said make the process that you can and will understand.

If you signed for it the maker must be prepared to evidence the FACTS, if not they are not with standing as they have either sold it or set it off, if it is a third party they are scamming for dollars, just ask them for the paper work they shows you owe anybody anything, they will tell you that they are working for WHATEVER CO, so ask for the paperwork showing that they are in fact working with that COMPANY, Remember if you pay anything you have agreed to the new contract with that SCAM COMPANY for the amount that they sent to you, so they tell you they are going to take you to court, Sure Santa is on his way with presents too, they can not take you to court they have nothing to take you to court with, so ask them for there first and last name as you are taking them and the SCAMMED COMPANY to court for vicious and firoulous action suit.Get Some Balls Ladies and Gentleman.


I know it works I make a living at this did you know what kind of mortgage you had? did you know you had mortgage defualt insureance that pays off your mortgage?If you filled a UCC-1 you couldve put a lien on the mortgage.did you make your money order to the treasury if so thats why it didnt work your mortgage money order is pay to the united states of america you can still file your defualt insureance look into it dont give up

to D lang #596415

D Lang.

How many times have you done this process? what steps did you take to file properly? :?


I too have tried with no success.Beware using the closed checking acct eft process.

All my checks returned for the exception of 1 in which I am still waiting. Fortunately I had the money to continue paying my bills. There are many trying to create their own style money orders, but wonder how long it would be before they are locked up.

A road I am not willing to take.I hate it when they say if it sounds to good to be true, it probably is.


Look at the UCC 1-308 process to reserve your rights regardless of what you sign.This should be stamped or in writ above your signature on all documents (without Prejudice UCC 1-308) and file a reservation of rights in the courthouse.

they don't like to take it so sometimes it can be filed on property in the deed file.doesn't matter as long as you can get a court certified copy after it is filed.


Also, if you decide to continue the struggle, check online for a book called "The Redemption Manual".

It is like a workbook which describes all the processes to becoming sovereign and even has samples of how to fill out all the paperwork.

I am in the process of doing it myself, so I would be happy to answer questions and share information with anyone at

God Bless!


I am so sorry to hear that you have lost so much material property.

But didn't Jesus say to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's? The loss of property sets you free and freedom is worth an amount of imaginary property or fiat money.

I am not surprised that lawyers and officials told you to 'drop it'. They want you to drop it bc they know that a sovereign individual who understands where His power comes from is out of their jurisdiction.

Just remember that you do not own anything. You have certain rights and they are to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness - but everything on the face of earth belongs to the Creator, God Almighty!

But you do have the right to fight for everything your Strawman owns.

I would say DON'T GIVE UP! Keep fighting for what you believe to be right.

Who knows... perhaps one day you will be the guru everyone looks to in order to learn more about the sovereignty process.

God Bless!


to Kasey. asking for the money.

The Zionists have it.

They are the bankers of the world.

They swindled the whole world and grabbed it all.


If you are wondering about federal liens check out the UFLRA (Uniform Federal Lien Registration Act)All federal liens must be certified and have the name, picture, and fingerprints of the acting IRS agent applying the liens. If not then demand it!


I am not here to talk about the A4V process, though I have been looking into everything for years. I am not advocating much of anything here except to read and see if things ring true. I understand that a good portion of where you are coming from is based on fact, like we have no real money or government. Just a quickly looking at the government one can quickly spot out way to many flaws, the biggest one for me is that no we are not a democracy, We are a Republic. but on to what I am here to say...

As I have said I have studied a lot on the topics of sovereignty, and have steadfastly refused to travel down anyone direction until I feel I can see what is really going on. While there are quite a few ways of going about it I have only came across a hand full of stuff that I feel is not total nonsense. I feel is on point in a good way.

However, These next two sites go hand in hand with each other, and from everything I have read and seen I feel they are closer to the truth.

The amount of information in these sites can be quite daunting at times, even for people that have been looking into the movement for some time. There is a link on both sites that says "start here," I suggest doing so, and then reading the book "The Great IRS Hoax," which you will come across on these sites. The book itself is fairly large (2,000+ pages) and just touches on how large the subject is, and there are many other books on the site. I feel that there is a lot of information in this work that everyone needs to know. Just to give you a quick foundation, there are 3 definitions of United States, how do you know which one is talked about within side statutes, the constitution etc. I will give you a hint though. you are not a U.S. Citizen if you were born in a state of the Union, you are a u.S. National. This is long enough. peace be with you all, and good luck. oh just one last thing, if you dont know who you really are nothing in this movement can help you.


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I've been trying the A4V stuff with no success either. Just started and now worry about the headache to come. All the research I've done on A4V leads me to believe it is a viable form of cancelling debts. I continually find new things people are trying and of course claim success at but do not offer any real solid guaranteed to be real and authentic truth. Most people offering up their ideas are just half way doing what needs to be done it seems. A lot of them want money for a system or a packet of instructions but in my opinion they should just give this info for nothing. Just publish it everywhere and if they still feel compelled to be compensated for giving the country back to the people then they should ask for donations or gifts. I would give but certainly not until I have actually gained from what they offer. Only because the claims they make. I think theSui Juris method can probably bw applied to property taxes. I 've got more reading to do and investigate.

An exerpt from a pub by Nord Davis Jr. how the IRS tricks us into paying income taxes...

Here is how the IRS tricks you into volunteering into the status of a U.S. individual and

subject of The District which in turn makes you subject to the Jurisdiction of The District. Examine a 1040

form and you will note that mixed in with the Name and Address, where you are to affix the IRS Label that

was on the envelope of IRS forms that they sent you, there is another word Label that really does not

have any logical reason for being there. That word Label has nothing whatever to do with your name and

address! That word has quite another meaning at law. Here is the first definition in Black's Law Dictionary:

"A slip of ribbon, parchment, or paper, attached as a codicil to a deed or other writing to hold the

appended seal." Your signature is your "seal." The 1040 Form is the Label that attaches as a codicil, an

intentional change or modification to a will, deed, contract or other writing. What you are doing when you

sign this Label is to waive those Constitutional Rights extended to us, the posterity of We, The People,

by our Forefathers, and petition for certain privileges extended to subjects, persons, and U.S. individuals of

The District. When you sign this Label, identified as the private corporate Internal Revenue Service, Inc.

1040 Label Form, you are attaching it as a codicil to your claim of the Bill of Rights. and under penalty of

perjury, are agreeing to waive your Common Law rights to Life, liberty and property. You did want it that

way, didn't you?


how many of you people have registered your strawman as a company with the US Securities and Exchange?


Our suffering has been similar my heart goes out to ALL...The worst part is that these road blocks are preventing the country from bailing itself out of ITS'own bankruptcy.That's why the road blocks!!!!


A4V is legal nonsense.It is based on nonsense.

The results of using that nonsense are, however, not nonsense.

RagingLou is just another in a long list of people who have been damaged by the falst claims of the A4V promoters who, as RagingLou said, disappear when the piper comes a calling for his due.


I strongly recommend, for the love of God, that everyone steer clear of that nonsense.The life, family and property you save will be your own.


Why are you attempting to settle the affairs of the name when the name is not of your creation?

If the name is not to be used as personal identification, then what is the true purpose of the name?

Could it be to administrate the condition of usufruct of the "conquering army"?

Check out Lieber Code part 31 and 38 and then compare to 1907 Hague Convention Articles 53 and 55.

Your claim in the name is what causes the controversy. Surrender "ownership" of that "substance" and the object casting the shadow will be yours to use without hindrance.


...and if you don't beleive that, then why don't you figure out why you're house, car etc, just went into the toilet for value, as well as so many other country's in the world...where'd the "money" go ?


Anybody that does'nt believe that the Gov, Fed, World Bank, IMF, etc, is screwing you, just google "Who runs the world economy", --- "economic hitman", --- "Bilderberger group" --- "creation of money", --- "money as debt"...You'll start to understand real fast.

There is no government, banking system without "you", ...and where did they get umpteen bazillion dollars to loan everybody to buy a house, car food etc.Wake up !


Tommy, your either a Democrat with his head up his *** or just an ignorant fool that doesn’t know or care about how bad the FED is screwing you. I Welcome You to the fools club of 70% tax payers and I pray for the day that you are laid off, loose your income, home, car, family and health. Then we'll see who wises up.


:( :( You people are idiots, each and every one of you.You don't want to pay taxes?

You don't want to have to pay back money you borrowed? Leave the country and go to Somalia, where there's no big government to get on your case and live the libertarian dream while trying to dodge Islamic kill squads. *Or* you can wise up, take the anti-psychotic medication you so desperately need, and pay your *** dues already.

Otherwise, I look forward to seeing you all rot in a debtor's prison for the rest of your lives after these "sovereign" scam artists take you for every penny they can get.Good riddance!


Send the Frivolous Filling Fees back



guess you don't understand the A4V process and who you are. maybe you jumped in to soon

and there testing you.


I’m very sorry that you’ve had so many problems with the A4V process and that it’s had a negative effect on your health.Our entanglements with the system can be very stressful, if not downright deadly.

However, we're all living through the economic collapse of our lifestyle and our country; we’re being victimized by the theft and misuse of the entire American treasury; terrible things are being done to people at home and around the world in our name. Nobody can deal with this on one’s own. We must band together in small self-help groups and create the future we want by strategizing our moves in this giant chess game of life. I'm lucky to have a few friends who have joined together to form a self-help study / support group as we each go through our various processes with the system.

We are becoming notaries public and creating a notary group to support and protect each other as we move into the unknown future. If any one of us goes to court, we need not stand alone and undefended. Our goal is for our notary group to have all the paper work in place and ready to release us, should the need arise. Why depend on a national educator, who is opening our minds to a new reality, to fly in for our day in court?

They might be dealing with a thousand emails a day for all we know. Instead, we need to create our own protective network of friends and acquaintances involved in similar ideas, to stand by us in our hours of need, just as we will stand by them. Each of us is learning and sharing our research and insights. We're helping each other write our letters, do our presentments and process our documents.

There are so many complexities to what’s going on that we have no choice but to learn as we go, make our mistakes, revise our strategies and grow in understanding and maturity each day. The good thing is that we also have the right & ability to correct our mistakes as we come to understand them. Face it ~ we’re all swimming in the polluted tide of a massive paradigm shift, and the only way we can prepare and protect ourselves is to join up with a small group of committed people and work to prepare and protect each other.

As for the difficulties that arise as we experience these fledgling new ideas put into action, I’d like to think of them as learning experiences rather than as grist for the shame and blame game.Best wishes as you continue to play in the game of life.

to Jeanne Detroit, Michigan, United States #601428

Hello Jeanne I have been studying this method for years and also feel the same way you do,we need to start a group of people with like minded to protect each other during this process,because I have heard of people getting killed for doing this,so if there is a group I would like to join,so if you could let me know

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